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Differences in Front Suspension 2009-2014

- - - - - suspension differences

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83 replies to this topic

#1
shawnhayes

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Okay guys,

 

One of the things I have noticed is....

 

I don't like the Michelin Pilot Super Sports.  And most EVERYBODY else that I know likes them just fine.

 

But guess what....the majority of the people that I have noticed that DON'T like them on CBA's.  But, specifically - 2009's

 

 

So, I bought the springs and dampers from a 2013.  (Thanks doug).  In an effort to try to be complete, I researched the differences in the suspension in the front in hopes that I could update if needed to newer geometry.  Boy was I in for a surprise....

 

So, lets cover the right hand front side only.  And, only the parts that are different....

 

Right hand lower control arm

 

54500-JF00B     2009 and a few 2010's ONLY

54500-JF50A     2010's ONLY  (?????)

54500-KB50A    2011-2012 (crosses over CBA to DBA, and may be superseded by the below part number)

54500-38B0A     2011-2014 (again ???? crossing over CBA and DBA)

 

Right hand upper control arm

 

54524-JF00C   2009 ONLY

54524-JF50A   2011-2014 (okay, what about the 2010's?)

 

I also found a 54524-62B0A, but cannot confirm this is a real part number belonging to any model year.

 

We were told that the suspension was reengineered for the DBA model year.. Uh, no it wasn't.

 

It appears to have been under constant development and changes EVERY YEAR since introduction.  So, I'm thinking that maybe the fact that most of the 2009 owners who don't like the Super Sports could have more in common than tire preferences.  I'm betting the suspension geometry of later years suits the Super Sports better.

 

I was also very interested in "updating" my control arms to later geometry and bushing compliance.

 

Uh...check the prices.  Effin wow.  That's not chump change.  The price difference is also dramatic.  The upper control arm for the 2009 is approx. $300, and for all later part numbers is $700.  Eeek.

 

I may just install the dampers and springs first and see what the results are before I jump on this, unless I find a junked front clip that's being parted out for a CBA car.

 

Thought you guys might be interested....

 

Shawn


Edited by shawnhayes, 20 April 2014 - 10:47 PM.

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#2
7racer

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makes me wonder what the 2015 suspension is like...or if the part numbers are different than the Nismo or Nismo N-attack package (probably same as normal Nismo).

 

Would love to see some of these pieces side by side....how much of the geometry can they tweak in such a tight space?


In7anity!!


#3
7racer

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found this searching the internet

http://www.2009gtr.c...-gt-r-with.html


In7anity!!


#4
7racer

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and maybe the new lower control arms with the increased caster is a bigger help

http://biser3a.com/c...012-what’s-new/


In7anity!!


#5
icarus

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Thanks Shawn for the detailed analysis…. however, there may be other changes or part differences you are missing (?)

 

Via, this reference, accredited to our very own and beloved NickTO there are significantly different alignment specifications of a 2011 GT-R versus 2012 GT-R:

http://www.2009gtr.c...-alignment.html

 

Of particular note, is maximum front camber spec is -1.83 for 2011 US model year, but -2.00 for 2012.

 

Per Nissan Official Press Release of MY2011 improvements (2012 US model):

http://www.nissan-gl...01018-01-e.html

 

Suspension and Braking Modifications
For the front suspension, the lever ratio of the springs, shock absorbers and stabilizer bar is modified to improve the vertical load response of the tires. Front caster angle is increased from 5°35 to 6°00 to improve tire road holding ability when turning and stability while driving straight.
For the rear suspension, toe performance is modified by changing the roll center height to a lower position in order to improve tire grip while making turns and to better communicate driving feel.
An aluminum free-piston shock absorber design is newly developed which generates more precise damping force to constantly provide stable road holding and a load shift that quickly responds to driver's intention. Reduced friction in the shock absorbers provides high quality, smooth ride comfort.
A thin, large-diameter rotor (390mm) developed uniquely by Nissan is adopted to improve braking force, fade resistance, pedal control ability and extend brake rotor life for sporty driving.

2014 NISSAN GT-R
Racing Brake - HKS - GotBoost Performance - AMS

#6
shawnhayes

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Thanks Shawn for the detailed analysis…. however, there may be other changes or part differences you are missing (?)

 

 

Yep.  Thanks to the both of you for directing me to that info from Nick - I loved that thread.  That's another part number that has now been superseded, but I will put it in the above information anyway.

 

Based on what I've found there may be a WHOLE LOT of other minor changes here and there, and not easily (or cheaply) changed.

 

Shawn



#7
icarus

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I think you will still benefit from upgrading the shocks and springs alone, even high quality shocks like Bilsteins simply wear out especially with track use. My guess is, you will be surprised how the ride quality and responsiveness will improve given the amount of track time your GT-R has seen.
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2014 NISSAN GT-R
Racing Brake - HKS - GotBoost Performance - AMS

#8
shawnhayes

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I think you will still benefit from upgrading the shocks and springs alone, even high quality shocks like Bilsteins simply wear out especially with track use. My guess is, you will be surprised how the ride quality and responsiveness will improve given the amount of track time your GT-R has seen.

 

I concur sir.  A superb point.  Now, If I could just find the time to remove that rear roll bar so I can get that back deck out.....

 

Delays, delays, delays...

 

Nothing but delays.

 

Shawn



#9
ian.r

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set your gtr back to stock, swap modified parts to new 2015 gtr.... finished!
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#10
descartesfool

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Nothing is going to make the Pilot Super Sports a great feeling tire on track for me. They just squirm like crazy, brake poorly at threshold compared to R-comps, and are just no fun when pushed at the limit. But I have had fun at 90-95% running on track with them. If you push them very hard, they overheat, because they are just not designed for serious track duty, as they are a street tire, not a track tire. Dampers and suspension geometry may improve the feel and ride over bumps and stuff, but they will do very little about the tire's response at maximum temperature, when the rubber gets out of its design temperature range.

 

Now a new Pilot Sport Cup 2 tire would be fantastic I think, if they weren't so super expensive.



#11
Jon H

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As far as track duty - didn't like the PSS on my 09 and didn't like the PSS on my 13.


Edited by Jon H, 21 April 2014 - 05:20 PM.

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2017 GT-R

2015 GT3 (Sold)

2013 GT-R (Sold)

BW CW13 - 1:50.6 https://youtu.be/CFau6MhJHa4

 


#12
icarus

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MPSS rock my world lol


2014 NISSAN GT-R
Racing Brake - HKS - GotBoost Performance - AMS

#13
NJNYCGTR

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I just got a set of Litchfield suspension, would i have been better off going with a used 2012+ suspension?
I read Davids post on his experience with the litchfield and they seem positive but do t see many others running them over the JRZ etc.
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#14
7racer

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I just got a set of Litchfield suspension, would i have been better off going with a used 2012+ suspension?
I read Davids post on his experience with the litchfield and they seem positive but do t see many others running them over the JRZ etc.

 

I really think it "depends".  I have the JRZs with custom valving from TSM and find they are ok.  I was specifically looking for something that matches me running "street"ish tires.

 

From what I read the Litchfields do the same thing...more of a "Nismo" like response but with the benefit of the retained electronic dampener adjustment.

 

As I have pushed my car harder and faster, I might be using up the limits of my suspension (maybe).  But that was one of the nice things about getting the coil overs and I can adjust the compression and rebound.

 

I do find some of the problems listed that might get dialed out with newer suspension pieces but I can try to adjust the caster more or camber.


In7anity!!


#15
shawnhayes

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I just got a set of Litchfield suspension, would i have been better off going with a used 2012+ suspension?
I read Davids post on his experience with the litchfield and they seem positive but do t see many others running them over the JRZ etc.

 

The Litchfield is a VERY well sorted set of components.  It is unknown at this time if any of the year's suspension, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, or 2014 can outperform the Litchfield on the track.  Now, on the STREET is another issue entirely.  It seems that the later years springs/dampers are MUCH better at giving a comfy ride vs. a 2009 in "comfort mode" - despite this, these later suspensions went FASTER on a track.  No one has compared a 2012 back to back with the Litchfield system yet.

 

So, I don't think you went wrong there.  VERY desirable suspension, my friend.

 

Shawn



#16
7racer

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The Litchfield is a VERY well sorted set of components.  It is unknown at this time if any of the year's suspension, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013, or 2014 can outperform the Litchfield on the track.  Now, on the STREET is another issue entirely.  It seems that the later years springs/dampers are MUCH better at giving a comfy ride vs. a 2009 in "comfort mode" - despite this, these later suspensions went FASTER on a track.  No one has compared a 2012 back to back with the Litchfield system yet.

 

So, I don't think you went wrong there.  VERY desirable suspension, my friend.

 

Shawn

 

this was one of the things that surprised me on the JRZs from TSM...they are sprung less.


In7anity!!


#17
NJNYCGTR

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Thanks shawn and 7 for your replies.
I picked the Litchfield because of street/track compromise as i drive mainly on the street except my car has been at the shop waiting for Top Secret parts for the past 5 weeks. Hopefully i can make VIR this year to test out the suspension.

7- haven't had an opportunity to put up pics of my Top Secret rear and brake light since my shop lost my original parts or put on someone else's GTR by accident. I dont think the parts are even in yet, sigh. Sorry this was a bit off topic.
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#18
7racer

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Thanks shawn and 7 for your replies.
I picked the Litchfield because of street/track compromise as i drive mainly on the street except my car has been at the shop waiting for Top Secret parts for the past 5 weeks. Hopefully i can make VIR this year to test out the suspension.

7- haven't had an opportunity to put up pics of my Top Secret rear and brake light since my shop lost my original parts or put on someone else's GTR by accident. I dont think the parts are even in yet, sigh. Sorry this was a bit off topic.

 

It's alright!  Let me know how the install goes.  I really like the look of the TS rear and F1 light.  I had a couple people with GTRs at COTA who thought I had a black edition or 2014.  Really updates the look in a subtle way.

 

I think you are in perfect shape with the suspension.  Definitely give it a good work out at VIR.  I want to try that track out someday!

 

In regards to my suspension, I purchased this book which a couple people recommended.  He seems to be the Nissan driver that set the Nurnbergring time with the Nismo

http://www.amazon.co...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

there is a nice chapter on suspension set up and how changing rebound and compression can effect mid corner and power out ability.  

I also had a private track session with a local pro.  When he found out I had an adjustable suspension he became super animated as he wanted to play with the settings to dial out some of the mid corner understeer that i have.


In7anity!!


#19
Santorican

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I just got a set of Litchfield suspension, would i have been better off going with a used 2012+ suspension?
I read Davids post on his experience with the litchfield and they seem positive but do t see many others running them over the JRZ etc.

Have fun replacing your rod ends in 5-10k miles! I'll just leave you this link for future reference. 

 

http://www.summitrac...t-type/rod-ends



#20
Santorican

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It's alright!  Let me know how the install goes.  I really like the look of the TS rear and F1 light.  I had a couple people with GTRs at COTA who thought I had a black edition or 2014.  Really updates the look in a subtle way.

 

I think you are in perfect shape with the suspension.  Definitely give it a good work out at VIR.  I want to try that track out someday!

 

In regards to my suspension, I purchased this book which a couple people recommended.  He seems to be the Nissan driver that set the Nurnbergring time with the Nismo

http://www.amazon.co...0?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

there is a nice chapter on suspension set up and how changing rebound and compression can effect mid corner and power out ability.  

I also had a private track session with a local pro.  When he found out I had an adjustable suspension he became super animated as he wanted to play with the settings to dial out some of the mid corner understeer that i have.

I would recommend reading all of these:

 

http://www.carrollsmith.com/books/

 

They're very cheap on Amazon

 

http://www.amazon.co...16403&rnid=1000


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