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Boost Logic Woes

boost logic turbos turbo inlets 1050x

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#1
awdtt

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With virtually zero miles on the car, and after it had dyno-ed at over 732 WHP/590 TQ on pump gas (torque-limited by Bill @ SiR's safe tune), my guy Danny did one final inspection and found this.
 
It is the final straw with Boost Logic.  From the pictures below, you can see that there is a clear possibility that the crappy welds inside of the intake pipes could have easily yielded a piece of slag that damaged the compressor wheel.  Everybody knows that if a washer or screw or some other fastener was left in the filter, the damage would have destroyed the wheel, not just nick it like this.
 
21167973 1922206941438821 6941047855141462696 O
 
I sent the picture above to BL along with a sample picture from these below.  They refuse to take responsibility for the damage and offered to cut me a break by selling me a replacement CHRA for $1197 (their price).
 
If this had been the first problem I had with this company, I'd probably pay the $1197.  But this is the last of a long list of screw-ups on their part.
 
1. Sent $8800 worth of turbos with cracked waste gate ports.
2. Compressor outlet didn't fit OEM hoses as advertised.
3. Wastegates were missing plugs, causing weird behavior.
4. Wastegate actuator nuts fell off during dyno testing.
5. Wastegate actuator diaphragm turned sideways, causing it to stay open, mimicking a boost leak.
6. Welds that are so poorly done that you can cut yourself if you put your hand inside.
 
And they suggested that we ran the car without filters.  Judge for yourself.

 

20170830 195215 1504138352332

20170830 195317 1504138343367
20170830 195450 1504138311277
21199694 1922230911436424 7905521659680591960 O
20170830 195429 1504138323136
20170830 195200 1504138361920
20170830 195515 1504138303586
 

Compare those welds with these.  I have more pictures that are even sweeter than these.  But it should be painfully obvious that the extra $1000 I overpaid for the intake kit wasn't worth it and was quite likely the reason that the wheel was damaged the way it was.

 

Screenshot 2017 08 30 20 51 10 1504141241121
Screenshot 2017 08 30 20 51 10 1504141241121
 
At this point, I'm considering my options.  I'm open to suggestions.

 


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2015 BE Frankenmotor


#2
BAZ007

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I'm sorry it came to this. I hope you find some comfort moving ahead with a better option. I said it before and will again now. TSM Elite Plus, you won't look back. Thank me later!
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#3
awdtt

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I'm sorry it came to this. I hope you find some comfort moving ahead with a better option. I said it before and will again now. TSM Elite Plus, you won't look back. Thank me later!

Well, if I was made of money, I'd do that, but I blew almost my entire budget for this year on those turbos and the labor to install them and get the car dynoed.  Between labor and parts, we're looking at roughly $16K to get this far.  Couple that with what it's going to cost to pull the motor to get the turbo off as well as check the IC piping, possibly heads and valves in the event the motor ingested a particle, I'm looking at another $2K in labor.  I can't afford to throw away $18K and start over.  It'll be far cheaper to hire an attorney in TX to begin legal action and get those f**king lame inlets off of the car.


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#4
7racer

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damn sorry to hear about this


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In7anity!!


#5
Racing Fan

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Hi Bob,

 

I am sorry you feel this way and have an unfortunate experience with our products. We have and many other shops in the US and Worldwide have used our titanium inlets and intakes without any issue. Our inlets and intake pipes are fused together without any filler rod. Additionally, the pie cuts are laser cut and cleaned, thereby not creating a possibility of slag. If there was a potential issue, I would be the first person to stand up and take care of the situation. It appears however that you had people working on your car which clearly aren't capable of the work they are performing.

 

I will respond to your points below:

 

1. Sent $8800 worth of turbos with cracked waste gate ports.
 
The Majority of stock manifold upgrades have fractures on the wastegate outlet port. This is normal and I confirmed this with a number of other vendors who make this style of upgrade. Nevertheless, I found a set of perfect ones off a 2015, had them modified, and shipped them next day to your install shop.
 
2. Compressor outlet didn't fit OEM hoses as advertised.
 
This was our mistake, we usually spec these parts with an intercooler piping kit and use the appropriate silicone but with stock piping, an additional pipe is needed. We payed for the fabrication for the additional pipe.
 
3. Wastegates were missing plugs, causing weird behavior.
 
We do not believe these were missing as we pack them with every kit. We believe your installer lost these and didn't install them.
 
4. Wastegate actuator nuts fell off during dyno testing.
 
Again, installation error. These should be tightened and pressure tested before installation of the motor into the car.
 
5. Wastegate actuator diaphragm turned sideways, causing it to stay open, mimicking a boost leak.
 
Again, install error, one that really tells the little knowledge the installer had as he bent the arm to sit improperly.
 
6. Welds that are so poorly done that you can cut yourself if you put your hand inside.
 
It is fused together pie cuts, this is normal and there will be some edges on the pie cuts.
 
I called you yesterday immediately when Jose informed me of your issues. I am 100% certain that our inlets didn't cause this and judging from the installation issues, it appears you just got stuck with a mechanic that didn't know what he was doing. After talking with you, i further believe this to be the case with all of the other issues and timeframe issues that became present.
 
I offered a replacement CHRA at my cost, and will still provide that for you. But I know this is not anything that is the fault of our product. I find the situation very unfortunate with all of the time and money wasted but hopefully the new mechanic you have the car with will be able to get the car running properly.
 
-Zohair

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Zohair Jaffery

#6
Fabshopmiami

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Sorry to hear this happened!

 

I use and have used BL titanium inlets/intakes from day one without any issues. Zohair is very fair, and BTW he knows a little more than us. I have been fabricating for a long time and I can say his titanium welds are very clean, always. Does not have slag. You have a ton of variables. First mistake is putting a bl1050 on a stock motor.....


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#7
cjmatt

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sucks youre continually having issues, but they seem to be only happening to you, which either means youre the unluckiest guy out there, or you need a better mechanic. my titanium intakes were a work of art and i pushed white tshirts through them and out the pipes and the shirts were all spotlessly clean before and after.



#8
J5isalive

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Sorry to hear this happened!

 

I use and have used BL titanium inlets/intakes from day one without any issues. Zohair is very fair, and BTW he knows a little more than us. I have been fabricating for a long time and I can say his titanium welds are very clean, always. Does not have slag. You have a ton of variables. First mistake is putting a bl1050 on a stock motor.....

 

His first mistake was being the guinea pig on an completely untested product and not heeding the advice of everyone to go with TSM Elites.   But he should have received support on this product which clearly he hasnt and thats very sad....

 

Sorry for your troubles!


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#9
cjmatt

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His first mistake was being the guinea pig on an completely untested product and not heeding the advice of everyone to go with TSM Elites.   But he should have received support on this product which clearly he hasnt and thats very sad....

 

Sorry for your troubles!

 

untested?



#10
Formidable

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Had the 3" boost logic titanium intakes when I was FBO. The pipes were clean and my compressor wheels looked good when the stock turbos were removed. I now have their 3.5" titanium intakes with TSM elites. Pipes were also clean and no issues thus far.

#11
awdtt

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His first mistake was being the guinea pig on an completely untested product and not heeding the advice of everyone to go with TSM Elites.   But he should have received support on this product which clearly he hasnt and thats very sad....

 

Sorry for your troubles!

In defense of BL, they did indeed offer support.  Up to the compressor wheel getting dinged.  But then the finger-pointed started. 


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#12
awdtt

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sucks youre continually having issues, but they seem to be only happening to you, which either means youre the unluckiest guy out there, or you need a better mechanic. my titanium intakes were a work of art and i pushed white tshirts through them and out the pipes and the shirts were all spotlessly clean before and after.

In all due respect, did you happen to notice the pictures of the inside of those intake pipes?  Do they represent a work of art?  I admit, I don't know anything at all about laser cutting, titanium fusing, or welding in general.  So, I have to go by what I'm told by individuals who fabricate things and know what they are looking at.  Also, I haven't been back to FL to see any of this in person.  I've been gone since early May.  So I can only go by what I'm told and what pictures are sent to me.


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#13
cjmatt

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In all due respect, did you happen to notice the pictures of the inside of those intake pipes?  Do they represent a work of art?  I admit, I don't know anything at all about laser cutting, titanium fusing, or welding in general.  So, I have to go by what I'm told by individuals who fabricate things and know what they are looking at.  Also, I haven't been back to FL to see any of this in person.  I've been gone since early May.  So I can only go by what I'm told and what pictures are sent to me.

 

In all due respect, its the inside of a pipe designed to flow clean air. If theyre clean on the inside they should work as advertised. The outside is all you see anyway so if those welds look good its really all that matters unless the insides are dirty, but cleaning pipes is always the first thing you should do no matter what. Anything that was in those pipes came from your mechanic because they dont weld the inners where slag would be present and the guy shouldve cleaned them anyway



#14
awdtt

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In all due respect, its the inside of a pipe designed to flow clean air. If theyre clean on the inside they should work as advertised. The outside is all you see anyway so if those welds look good its really all that matters unless the insides are dirty, but cleaning pipes is always the first thing you should do no matter what. Anything that was in those pipes came from your mechanic because they dont weld the inners where slag would be present and the guy shouldve cleaned them anyway

Actually, it turns out that when you heat titanium on one side but don't absorb the heat on the backside using a back fill, it creates a corrosive, flakey surface which needs to be brushed so that it's devoid of impurities. The pictures show a dull surface and that's why we've been complaining that the quality is low. I bring your attention to the last two pictures above which show a proper set of pie cut welds.

https://www.millerwe...lding-practices

In there, they show the importance of back purging as well as grinding down sharp edges before welding/fusing.

And, when someone spends almost $10k list price for a pair of turbos and intakes, they should not need to go through additional manufacturing processes. They should be ready to go. These turbos used the non-locking nuts on the actuator arms. Many wastegate setups use a cotter pin to prevent the arm from coming out. Design issue.

Edited by awdtt, 01 September 2017 - 06:35 AM.

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#15
7racer

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man Bob, still sorry to hear about this. You can tell the frustration from the other side of the computer.

 

What are you going to do?


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In7anity!!


#16
awdtt

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man Bob, still sorry to hear about this. You can tell the frustration from the other side of the computer.

 

What are you going to do?

I retained an attorney in Temple.  We have a conference call setup for Tuesday afternoon.  Meanwhile, we are taking the entire intake-turbo-IC-throttle body apart to find the piece of shit that made it through the compressor.  Once we find it, we'll analyze it to determine its metallic properties.


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#17
Doug@WGP

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I retained an attorney in Temple. We have a conference call setup for Tuesday afternoon. Meanwhile, we are taking the entire intake-turbo-IC-throttle body apart to find the piece of shit that made it through the compressor. Once we find it, we'll analyze it to determine its metallic properties.


Assuming it made it through all that... hopefully it didn't make it into the combustion chamber... i'd put a horoscope in your cylinders to check for scoring and also drain the oil and retain a sample for blackstone testing ... the piece is probably very small...
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Doug Ross
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#18
awdtt

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Assuming it made it through all that... hopefully it didn't make it into the combustion chamber... i'd put a horoscope in your cylinders to check for scoring and also drain the oil and retain a sample for blackstone testing ... the piece is probably very small...

Yup.  That sounds like a good idea.  Danny was about to do the oil change anyway.  Whatever it was, it was tiny, like less than .5mm, or else that compressor wheel would have been destroyed.   


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#19
Doug@WGP

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The smart move, as crappy as it sounds... is a complete tear down.

Doug Ross
Owner of Weapons Grade Performance
-Northeast/Pacific Northwest Shops where we ONLY work on GT-Rs
-Owner/Builder of the 1st Ever Home Garage GT-R Drivetrain Removal
Cobb Protuner / EcuTek Tuner
-All Wheel Drive Mustang Dyno in House
doug@weaponsgradeperformance.com
Our Online Store
East Coast Location 226 N. Plains Industrial Rd, Wallingford CT 06492 203-668-4765


#20
pgordon888

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This is why buying a kit through a manufacturer's approved dealer and installer is the way to go.  It may cost more than buying direct because of sales tax and dealer margin but any defect claims/install issues would hopefully be handled between the manufacturer and the installer rather than through the retail customer.  I am a big fan of the under one roof approach to performance mods.    Causation in these types of legal disputes is very hard to prove.  Strong interpersonal relationships and mutual trust  between a customer and a shop that can take ownership of a customer's whole build because all parts and work on the car have been through the shop is the much better approach. 

 

That being said I hope the OP gets his car fixed and running really well.   This situation really sucks.               


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